Wimbledon 2009
king_roger je napisao/la:
križevci je napisao/la:
agassi je napisao/la:
Fedex je bio i statistički bolji u ovom meču a kad gledamo cijeli turnir imao je najteže protivnike i više nego zasluzeno je osvojio ovaj turnir. Taktika da forsira backand slice i da ne otvara prostor backand paralelama već se pouzda u forehand i servis su mu pokvarili umjetnički dojam . Na turniru je pokazao veliku raznovrsnost, ali danas je pritisak bio velik. Misija je završena, mogli bi na slijedećim GS vidjeti još boljeg Federera.
Nekorektno je spominjanje sreće kad se zna da je Nadal u zadnja 2 finala u kojem ga je dobio imalo dosta sreće , zapravo Fedex je imao još važnih poraza u kojima je bio statistički bolji a rijetke su njegove pobjede tog tipa.
Vidi cijeli citat
Netko s nickom Agassi nebi smio prosrat ovakvu glupost..
Pa Roddick je imal daleko teže protivnike..od osmine finala Berdych,Hewitt,Murray
A Feđo od osmine finala nadalje imal Kolšrajbera,Karlo derpe i Haas..
po meni je Andy imal prilično zajebaniji ždrijeb
Vidi cijeli citat
Berdych, Hewitt??? Igrali su oboji ca s Federerom u W-u, Hewitt i više puta, pa pogledaj kako su prošli... U ovom trenutku je Soderling teži protivnik od njih dvojice zajedno...
Vidi cijeli citat
Ha dobro,ja i dalje mislim da je Roddick imal malo jači ždrijeb,Hewitt je ipak bil u sjajnom izdanju ova 2 tjedna al dobro,pa kud bi svijet došel da nam se svima mišljenja poklapaju
nek i Krušlin vidi Rija, al Hrvatsku sine voli
križevci je napisao/la:
wwww je napisao/la:
Čestitke Federeru, ali navijala sam za Roddicka.I da, i meni taj Mićo sve više ide na živce , ne mogu vjerovati da mi je nekad bio simpatičan.
Vidi cijeli citat
Ma Čomi je seljak,osim onog kaj sam mnogo put napisal o njemu i njegovoj simpatiji Feđi,počel me je strašno i živcirat dok i naši igraju..daleko je to od dana kad je komentiral Zeca
Vidi cijeli citat
Mislim da je bio cijeli u mecu bio kad je komentirao Gorana, i djelio je emocije, danas kad komentira nase tenisace, izgleda ko preko one stvari da komentira, sve ti jasno da nema vise onih famoznih zvukova i uzdaha, danas ispali jedan dva u cijelom mecuking_roger je napisao/la:
križevci je napisao/la:
Ray Ray je napisao/la:
Bez obzira na 15 Grand Slam naslova(od kojih je zadnja 2 uzeo samo zato jer nema pravog šampiona Rafe)za mene federer definitivno nije najveći kako ga se proglašuje..i srce me boli jer je skinuo Pete-a koji je za mene i dalje num.1 !
A Rafa se uskoro vraća još jači tako da će mu roger opet gledat u leđa !!
Vidi cijeli citat
Otprilike isto ja tupim zadnja 2 tjedna..pogotovo se slažem u dijelu vezanim za Rafu..
Samo je pitanje dal će se Rafa vratit,mislim normalno da se bu vratil,samo je pitanje u kakvom stanju je njegovo koljeno i kolko bu još izdržalo..
Vidi cijeli citat
@ Ray Ray : pravi šampioni znaju pravilno igrati i pravilno trenirati, što se za Rafu baš i ne može reći.
@ Križevci : Primijetio sam da si veliki Nadalov navijač ( što poštujem) ,ali još veći Federerov mrzitelj. To je tvoja stvar, briga me. Vidjet ćemo kad se Rafa vrati. Zanima me samo hoćeš li ti i tebi slični govoriti kako Nadal nije "onaj pravi" ako nastavi gubit od Federera....
Vidi cijeli citat
Dobro primjećuješ..I ja sam primjetil da ti navijaš za Feđu(i ja to poštujem,ima razloga da ga ljudi poštuju) al jednostavno mi je Nadal jači igrač iz razloga jer ga u međusobnim dvobojima uvjerljivo vodi..
nek i Krušlin vidi Rija, al Hrvatsku sine voli
Zidanes&Pavones je napisao/la:
križevci je napisao/la:
wwww je napisao/la:
Čestitke Federeru, ali navijala sam za Roddicka.I da, i meni taj Mićo sve više ide na živce , ne mogu vjerovati da mi je nekad bio simpatičan.
Vidi cijeli citat
Ma Čomi je seljak,osim onog kaj sam mnogo put napisal o njemu i njegovoj simpatiji Feđi,počel me je strašno i živcirat dok i naši igraju..daleko je to od dana kad je komentiral Zeca
Vidi cijeli citat
Mislim da je bio cijeli u mecu bio kad je komentirao Gorana, i djelio je emocije, danas kad komentira nase tenisace, izgleda ko preko one stvari da komentira, sve ti jasno da nema vise onih famoznih zvukova i uzdaha, danas ispali jedan dva u cijelom mecuVidi cijeli citat
Eh ti uzdasi dok lopta recimo ostane na vrhu mreže,ili neki sitni aut..
Takve zvukove još samo ispušta u ženinom društvu u krevetu..
nek i Krušlin vidi Rija, al Hrvatsku sine voli
Kajser je napisao/la:
andrija Nis je napisao/la:
Kad je imao 3-4 godine njegovi su otisli iz BG u Kanadu...Inace,rodjen je kao Nestorovic
Vidi cijeli citat
Tek sam sad video ovu glupost.
On je rodjen u Beogradu ali mu je otac Makedonski Vlah iz Ohrida.
O Ohiridu i dan danas ima ljudi koji se prezivaju Nestor.
Vidi cijeli citat
izvini chiko...nadam se da necu proci lose zbog gluposti?
Mada,ja ne vidim da sam negde pominjao nacionalnost pa mi nije jasno sta je tu glupost?
Meni je plasirana pogresna informacija..
Mozes da ukucas u google Daniel Nestorovic pa procitaj sta pise...
[uredio andrija Nis - 06. srpnja 2009. u 00:01]
Nozh je napisao/la:
vidi šta ljudi pljuju...pa šta još čovjek mora osvojiti da vi shvatite da je on ...svih vremena?pa zar brojke nisu jedini pravi pokazatelj,čovjek je osvojio sva 4 grand slama (sampras je na RG najdalje stigao do polufinala),i još najviše grand slamova.to je isto kada govorite da npr. real (nisam njihov simpatizer!) nije najveći klub,a ovi u vitrinama trofeja koliko nitko drugi nema.
samo treba naići pametnjaković koji će izvaliti da nije najveći zato što nije pobjedio borga npr.
osvajanje grand slama nikako nije slučajnost,a kamoli njih 15!
Vidi cijeli citat
Brojke su pokazatelj koji se najčešće uzima kao mjerilo, ali ne moraju biti pravi pokazatelj.
Kad si već spomenuo Real, to se isto može uzeti kao primjer. Ljudi obično govore da su najveći klub na svijetu jer su 9 puta bili prvaci Europe, a rijetki uzimaju u obzir da su 6 od tih 9 naslova osvojili krajem 50-ih i početkom 60-ih, kad je Kup prvaka bio tek u formiranju i pola država se nije natjecalo.
Isto tako i ovdje će se pamtiti Federer kao čovjek s najviše Grand Slamova i smatrat se najboljim sve dok ga netko drugi ne prestigne. Ostalo će se zaboraviti pa i činjenica da od odlaska Samprasa pa do pojave Nadala nikad nije bila slabija konkurencija, a u tom razdoblju je Federer osvojio najveći dio naslova. Isto tako se može reći da bi da se nije pojavio Nadal Federer sad imao do 20 GS-ova, nije lako 6 puta gubit finala od istog čovjeka, pa se s te strane može reći da nije imao sreće kako je imao u onom prije.
Sve to će pamtiti samo zagriženiji ljubitelji sporta i to oni koji su živjeli u tom vremenu, ostali će gledat brojke koje su na Federerovoj strani.
Al ga nasrah, tek sad vidjeh koliki je post ispao, a htio jednostavno objasnit.
sve prolazi sve se mijenja, idu dani idu godine, samo Zrinjski ostaje ponos moje Hercegovine
Baš si ga nasra.. no evo posta sa kojim se slažem 100% a tiče se tzv 'slabe ere'
Why this is not a weak era.
I
know this has been argued again and again, but it really is a
disrespect to every player on tour right now to say this is a weak era.
It is also an absurd argument against Federer being the GOAT. There are
three major reasons for this:
1. A player's draw looks better decades later than it does at the time.
This is because we do not know the success that young players playing right now might have. For instance, right now, Federer beating Murray in the 08 US Open finals looks respectable but nothing special. However, Murray is young and I fully expect that he will win 3-6 grand slams in his career. If that happens, Federer's victory over him suddenly looks a lot better. Basically, the point is that the players Federer is beating now will have success later, and thus those victories will look better in the future, just like victories of players like Sampras and such look better after time.
Let me illustrate this again with another example. In 2003, Nalbandian beat Federer in the 4th round of the Australian Open. At the time of that victory, some people on here probably would've said "Federer is a clown who hasn't been beyond the quarters of any slam and it still took Nalbandian 5 sets." In retrospect, that victory looks VERY impressive. Federer's victories now will be similar in many cases.
2. It is inherently illogical to say that a player can't be the greatest because he dominated players who haven't won many slams.
This is rather obvious but doesn't occur to many people. If you dominate an era, that means you are winning just about every slam. This means that no matter how good the other players are, they won't rack up lots of slams. That doesn't show that the other players aren't good. It simply shows that the dominating player is far better.
Here's the example I haven always given. Let's say that somehow there was a perfect tennis player created. This perfect player plays in an era with Federer, Sampras, Laver, Borg, McEnroe, Connors, Agassi, Becker, Edberg, and Wilander. Obviously, this is an ABSURDLY strong era. However, this is a PERFECT tennis player, so he still wins about 3 slams a year, leaving none of those 10 all time greats with many slams. Does this make those players weak? Absolutely not. Number of slams won is NOT solely indicative of a player's ability, but rather how much better he is than those around him. In our case, Federer was so much better than everyone else (except on clay where Nadal was better than everyone else) that no one else got many slams. That does NOT mean they are any worse than players in previous eras who did win slams.
Let's delve into this a bit more.
- Federer beat Marat Safin 4 times in slams. Safin would probably have 3 or 4 slams instead of 2 if Federer wasn't there.
- He beat Lleyton Hewitt 6 times at high rounds of slams. Hewitt would probably have about 5 slams if Federer wasn't there.
- He beat Andy Roddick 7 times (probably will be 8 after tomorrow) in the quarters or above of slams. Roddick would have won these slams without Federer there. He would probably have 6 or 7 slams overall (especially given this Wimbledon) if Federer wasn't there.
- He beat Nalbandian 3 times in high rounds. I think Nalbandian would have won a slam or two without Federer.
- Federer has probably robbed Haas of 1 or 2 slams as well.
- He has already beaten Djokovic 3 times at high levels of slams, so I would say Djokovic would probaby have 3 slams already without Federer.
- Del Potro and Murray are just getting started, but both would probably have slams (09 FO and 08 US respectively) if Federer wasn't there.
Basically, the point is that without Federer, these players who people say are bad because they didnt win many slams WOULD have won many slams. They WOULD be considered great. To say that Federer's opponents were weak because Federer always won is tantamount to saying "Federer is not the greatest because he dominated everyone too much." It is ridiculous.
3. Right now the lower ranked players are better than in years prior. This makes the higher ranked players SEEM less good when they are not.
The fact is that the level of the lower ranked players in this era is undoubtedly better than in years past. Anyone, including Pete Sampras, would/does agree with this. This means that it is way easier for a top player to lose in early rounds of a slam, because they are simply facing higher quality players in early rounds. What this means is that it is a lot harder for any single player to consistently get to higher rounds of slams. As a result, the top players dont SEEM as consistent as top players in previous decades because they have lost early sometimes. For this reason, people here call those top players lame. That is not the case. It is just that the difference between top ranked and lower ranked players is not as big as before. That does NOT in any way mean that the top ranked players are not as good as previous decades' top ranked players.
CONCLUSION: In today's era there is a smaller gap between top players and lower ranked players. This makes it harder for the top players to look consistent. Furthermore, Federer has been so far ahead of everyone (except Nadal) that even the more consistent players didnt win many slams, as Federer took them. These things BY NO MEANS show that today's top players are weak. It simply shows that the overall talent pool is higher AND that Federer was head and shoulders above everyone else. The idea that his opponents were weak is basically saying "Since he was better than everyone in his era, he must not be the best ever." What I just said applies mostly to the older players that Federer beat. In terms of up and coming players, Federer's victories over them will look more impressive in many years after they are retired with many victories to their names too. This is not a weak era.
1. A player's draw looks better decades later than it does at the time.
This is because we do not know the success that young players playing right now might have. For instance, right now, Federer beating Murray in the 08 US Open finals looks respectable but nothing special. However, Murray is young and I fully expect that he will win 3-6 grand slams in his career. If that happens, Federer's victory over him suddenly looks a lot better. Basically, the point is that the players Federer is beating now will have success later, and thus those victories will look better in the future, just like victories of players like Sampras and such look better after time.
Let me illustrate this again with another example. In 2003, Nalbandian beat Federer in the 4th round of the Australian Open. At the time of that victory, some people on here probably would've said "Federer is a clown who hasn't been beyond the quarters of any slam and it still took Nalbandian 5 sets." In retrospect, that victory looks VERY impressive. Federer's victories now will be similar in many cases.
2. It is inherently illogical to say that a player can't be the greatest because he dominated players who haven't won many slams.
This is rather obvious but doesn't occur to many people. If you dominate an era, that means you are winning just about every slam. This means that no matter how good the other players are, they won't rack up lots of slams. That doesn't show that the other players aren't good. It simply shows that the dominating player is far better.
Here's the example I haven always given. Let's say that somehow there was a perfect tennis player created. This perfect player plays in an era with Federer, Sampras, Laver, Borg, McEnroe, Connors, Agassi, Becker, Edberg, and Wilander. Obviously, this is an ABSURDLY strong era. However, this is a PERFECT tennis player, so he still wins about 3 slams a year, leaving none of those 10 all time greats with many slams. Does this make those players weak? Absolutely not. Number of slams won is NOT solely indicative of a player's ability, but rather how much better he is than those around him. In our case, Federer was so much better than everyone else (except on clay where Nadal was better than everyone else) that no one else got many slams. That does NOT mean they are any worse than players in previous eras who did win slams.
Let's delve into this a bit more.
- Federer beat Marat Safin 4 times in slams. Safin would probably have 3 or 4 slams instead of 2 if Federer wasn't there.
- He beat Lleyton Hewitt 6 times at high rounds of slams. Hewitt would probably have about 5 slams if Federer wasn't there.
- He beat Andy Roddick 7 times (probably will be 8 after tomorrow) in the quarters or above of slams. Roddick would have won these slams without Federer there. He would probably have 6 or 7 slams overall (especially given this Wimbledon) if Federer wasn't there.
- He beat Nalbandian 3 times in high rounds. I think Nalbandian would have won a slam or two without Federer.
- Federer has probably robbed Haas of 1 or 2 slams as well.
- He has already beaten Djokovic 3 times at high levels of slams, so I would say Djokovic would probaby have 3 slams already without Federer.
- Del Potro and Murray are just getting started, but both would probably have slams (09 FO and 08 US respectively) if Federer wasn't there.
Basically, the point is that without Federer, these players who people say are bad because they didnt win many slams WOULD have won many slams. They WOULD be considered great. To say that Federer's opponents were weak because Federer always won is tantamount to saying "Federer is not the greatest because he dominated everyone too much." It is ridiculous.
3. Right now the lower ranked players are better than in years prior. This makes the higher ranked players SEEM less good when they are not.
The fact is that the level of the lower ranked players in this era is undoubtedly better than in years past. Anyone, including Pete Sampras, would/does agree with this. This means that it is way easier for a top player to lose in early rounds of a slam, because they are simply facing higher quality players in early rounds. What this means is that it is a lot harder for any single player to consistently get to higher rounds of slams. As a result, the top players dont SEEM as consistent as top players in previous decades because they have lost early sometimes. For this reason, people here call those top players lame. That is not the case. It is just that the difference between top ranked and lower ranked players is not as big as before. That does NOT in any way mean that the top ranked players are not as good as previous decades' top ranked players.
CONCLUSION: In today's era there is a smaller gap between top players and lower ranked players. This makes it harder for the top players to look consistent. Furthermore, Federer has been so far ahead of everyone (except Nadal) that even the more consistent players didnt win many slams, as Federer took them. These things BY NO MEANS show that today's top players are weak. It simply shows that the overall talent pool is higher AND that Federer was head and shoulders above everyone else. The idea that his opponents were weak is basically saying "Since he was better than everyone in his era, he must not be the best ever." What I just said applies mostly to the older players that Federer beat. In terms of up and coming players, Federer's victories over them will look more impressive in many years after they are retired with many victories to their names too. This is not a weak era.
"Smoke me a kipper, I'll be back for breakfast!" 🎸⚽🏀🎨
dr.Damir je napisao/la:
Nozh je napisao/la:
vidi šta ljudi pljuju...pa šta još čovjek mora osvojiti da vi shvatite da je on ...svih vremena?pa zar brojke nisu jedini pravi pokazatelj,čovjek je osvojio sva 4 grand slama (sampras je na RG najdalje stigao do polufinala),i još najviše grand slamova.to je isto kada govorite da npr. real (nisam njihov simpatizer!) nije najveći klub,a ovi u vitrinama trofeja koliko nitko drugi nema.
samo treba naići pametnjaković koji će izvaliti da nije najveći zato što nije pobjedio borga npr.
osvajanje grand slama nikako nije slučajnost,a kamoli njih 15!
Vidi cijeli citat
Brojke su pokazatelj koji se najčešće uzima kao mjerilo, ali ne moraju biti pravi pokazatelj.
Kad si već spomenuo Real, to se isto može uzeti kao primjer. Ljudi obično govore da su najveći klub na svijetu jer su 9 puta bili prvaci Europe, a rijetki uzimaju u obzir da su 6 od tih 9 naslova osvojili krajem 50-ih i početkom 60-ih, kad je Kup prvaka bio tek u formiranju i pola država se nije natjecalo.
Isto tako i ovdje će se pamtiti Federer kao čovjek s najviše Grand Slamova i smatrat se najboljim sve dok ga netko drugi ne prestigne. Ostalo će se zaboraviti pa i činjenica da od odlaska Samprasa pa do pojave Nadala nikad nije bila slabija konkurencija, a u tom razdoblju je Federer osvojio najveći dio naslova. Isto tako se može reći da bi da se nije pojavio Nadal Federer sad imao do 20 GS-ova, nije lako 6 puta gubit finala od istog čovjeka, pa se s te strane može reći da nije imao sreće kako je imao u onom prije.
Sve to će pamtiti samo zagriženiji ljubitelji sporta i to oni koji su živjeli u tom vremenu, ostali će gledat brojke koje su na Federerovoj strani.
Al ga nasrah, tek sad vidjeh koliki je post ispao, a htio jednostavno objasnit.
Vidi cijeli citat
Čekaj, Nadal se "pojavio" 2005, jel? Tada je uzeo prvi RG. Federer je od tada do danas osvojio 11 GS-a, mislim da je ipak to većina od ukupnih 15.
madmax17 je napisao/la:
Baš si ga nasra.. no evo posta sa kojim se slažem 100% a tiče se tzv 'slabe ere' Why this is not a weak era.
I
know this has been argued again and again, but it really is a
disrespect to every player on tour right now to say this is a weak era.
It is also an absurd argument against Federer being the GOAT. There are
three major reasons for this:
1. A player's draw looks better decades later than it does at the time.
This is because we do not know the success that young players playing right now might have. For instance, right now, Federer beating Murray in the 08 US Open finals looks respectable but nothing special. However, Murray is young and I fully expect that he will win 3-6 grand slams in his career. If that happens, Federer's victory over him suddenly looks a lot better. Basically, the point is that the players Federer is beating now will have success later, and thus those victories will look better in the future, just like victories of players like Sampras and such look better after time.
Let me illustrate this again with another example. In 2003, Nalbandian beat Federer in the 4th round of the Australian Open. At the time of that victory, some people on here probably would've said "Federer is a clown who hasn't been beyond the quarters of any slam and it still took Nalbandian 5 sets." In retrospect, that victory looks VERY impressive. Federer's victories now will be similar in many cases.
2. It is inherently illogical to say that a player can't be the greatest because he dominated players who haven't won many slams.
This is rather obvious but doesn't occur to many people. If you dominate an era, that means you are winning just about every slam. This means that no matter how good the other players are, they won't rack up lots of slams. That doesn't show that the other players aren't good. It simply shows that the dominating player is far better.
Here's the example I haven always given. Let's say that somehow there was a perfect tennis player created. This perfect player plays in an era with Federer, Sampras, Laver, Borg, McEnroe, Connors, Agassi, Becker, Edberg, and Wilander. Obviously, this is an ABSURDLY strong era. However, this is a PERFECT tennis player, so he still wins about 3 slams a year, leaving none of those 10 all time greats with many slams. Does this make those players weak? Absolutely not. Number of slams won is NOT solely indicative of a player's ability, but rather how much better he is than those around him. In our case, Federer was so much better than everyone else (except on clay where Nadal was better than everyone else) that no one else got many slams. That does NOT mean they are any worse than players in previous eras who did win slams.
Let's delve into this a bit more.
- Federer beat Marat Safin 4 times in slams. Safin would probably have 3 or 4 slams instead of 2 if Federer wasn't there.
- He beat Lleyton Hewitt 6 times at high rounds of slams. Hewitt would probably have about 5 slams if Federer wasn't there.
- He beat Andy Roddick 7 times (probably will be 8 after tomorrow) in the quarters or above of slams. Roddick would have won these slams without Federer there. He would probably have 6 or 7 slams overall (especially given this Wimbledon) if Federer wasn't there.
- He beat Nalbandian 3 times in high rounds. I think Nalbandian would have won a slam or two without Federer.
- Federer has probably robbed Haas of 1 or 2 slams as well.
- He has already beaten Djokovic 3 times at high levels of slams, so I would say Djokovic would probaby have 3 slams already without Federer.
- Del Potro and Murray are just getting started, but both would probably have slams (09 FO and 08 US respectively) if Federer wasn't there.
Basically, the point is that without Federer, these players who people say are bad because they didnt win many slams WOULD have won many slams. They WOULD be considered great. To say that Federer's opponents were weak because Federer always won is tantamount to saying "Federer is not the greatest because he dominated everyone too much." It is ridiculous.
3. Right now the lower ranked players are better than in years prior. This makes the higher ranked players SEEM less good when they are not.
The fact is that the level of the lower ranked players in this era is undoubtedly better than in years past. Anyone, including Pete Sampras, would/does agree with this. This means that it is way easier for a top player to lose in early rounds of a slam, because they are simply facing higher quality players in early rounds. What this means is that it is a lot harder for any single player to consistently get to higher rounds of slams. As a result, the top players dont SEEM as consistent as top players in previous decades because they have lost early sometimes. For this reason, people here call those top players lame. That is not the case. It is just that the difference between top ranked and lower ranked players is not as big as before. That does NOT in any way mean that the top ranked players are not as good as previous decades' top ranked players.
CONCLUSION: In today's era there is a smaller gap between top players and lower ranked players. This makes it harder for the top players to look consistent. Furthermore, Federer has been so far ahead of everyone (except Nadal) that even the more consistent players didnt win many slams, as Federer took them. These things BY NO MEANS show that today's top players are weak. It simply shows that the overall talent pool is higher AND that Federer was head and shoulders above everyone else. The idea that his opponents were weak is basically saying "Since he was better than everyone in his era, he must not be the best ever." What I just said applies mostly to the older players that Federer beat. In terms of up and coming players, Federer's victories over them will look more impressive in many years after they are retired with many victories to their names too. This is not a weak era.
1. A player's draw looks better decades later than it does at the time.
This is because we do not know the success that young players playing right now might have. For instance, right now, Federer beating Murray in the 08 US Open finals looks respectable but nothing special. However, Murray is young and I fully expect that he will win 3-6 grand slams in his career. If that happens, Federer's victory over him suddenly looks a lot better. Basically, the point is that the players Federer is beating now will have success later, and thus those victories will look better in the future, just like victories of players like Sampras and such look better after time.
Let me illustrate this again with another example. In 2003, Nalbandian beat Federer in the 4th round of the Australian Open. At the time of that victory, some people on here probably would've said "Federer is a clown who hasn't been beyond the quarters of any slam and it still took Nalbandian 5 sets." In retrospect, that victory looks VERY impressive. Federer's victories now will be similar in many cases.
2. It is inherently illogical to say that a player can't be the greatest because he dominated players who haven't won many slams.
This is rather obvious but doesn't occur to many people. If you dominate an era, that means you are winning just about every slam. This means that no matter how good the other players are, they won't rack up lots of slams. That doesn't show that the other players aren't good. It simply shows that the dominating player is far better.
Here's the example I haven always given. Let's say that somehow there was a perfect tennis player created. This perfect player plays in an era with Federer, Sampras, Laver, Borg, McEnroe, Connors, Agassi, Becker, Edberg, and Wilander. Obviously, this is an ABSURDLY strong era. However, this is a PERFECT tennis player, so he still wins about 3 slams a year, leaving none of those 10 all time greats with many slams. Does this make those players weak? Absolutely not. Number of slams won is NOT solely indicative of a player's ability, but rather how much better he is than those around him. In our case, Federer was so much better than everyone else (except on clay where Nadal was better than everyone else) that no one else got many slams. That does NOT mean they are any worse than players in previous eras who did win slams.
Let's delve into this a bit more.
- Federer beat Marat Safin 4 times in slams. Safin would probably have 3 or 4 slams instead of 2 if Federer wasn't there.
- He beat Lleyton Hewitt 6 times at high rounds of slams. Hewitt would probably have about 5 slams if Federer wasn't there.
- He beat Andy Roddick 7 times (probably will be 8 after tomorrow) in the quarters or above of slams. Roddick would have won these slams without Federer there. He would probably have 6 or 7 slams overall (especially given this Wimbledon) if Federer wasn't there.
- He beat Nalbandian 3 times in high rounds. I think Nalbandian would have won a slam or two without Federer.
- Federer has probably robbed Haas of 1 or 2 slams as well.
- He has already beaten Djokovic 3 times at high levels of slams, so I would say Djokovic would probaby have 3 slams already without Federer.
- Del Potro and Murray are just getting started, but both would probably have slams (09 FO and 08 US respectively) if Federer wasn't there.
Basically, the point is that without Federer, these players who people say are bad because they didnt win many slams WOULD have won many slams. They WOULD be considered great. To say that Federer's opponents were weak because Federer always won is tantamount to saying "Federer is not the greatest because he dominated everyone too much." It is ridiculous.
3. Right now the lower ranked players are better than in years prior. This makes the higher ranked players SEEM less good when they are not.
The fact is that the level of the lower ranked players in this era is undoubtedly better than in years past. Anyone, including Pete Sampras, would/does agree with this. This means that it is way easier for a top player to lose in early rounds of a slam, because they are simply facing higher quality players in early rounds. What this means is that it is a lot harder for any single player to consistently get to higher rounds of slams. As a result, the top players dont SEEM as consistent as top players in previous decades because they have lost early sometimes. For this reason, people here call those top players lame. That is not the case. It is just that the difference between top ranked and lower ranked players is not as big as before. That does NOT in any way mean that the top ranked players are not as good as previous decades' top ranked players.
CONCLUSION: In today's era there is a smaller gap between top players and lower ranked players. This makes it harder for the top players to look consistent. Furthermore, Federer has been so far ahead of everyone (except Nadal) that even the more consistent players didnt win many slams, as Federer took them. These things BY NO MEANS show that today's top players are weak. It simply shows that the overall talent pool is higher AND that Federer was head and shoulders above everyone else. The idea that his opponents were weak is basically saying "Since he was better than everyone in his era, he must not be the best ever." What I just said applies mostly to the older players that Federer beat. In terms of up and coming players, Federer's victories over them will look more impressive in many years after they are retired with many victories to their names too. This is not a weak era.
Vidi cijeli citat
Max, ovo je odličan post, gdje si ga našao ? Jel neki forum ili neki novinarski članak?
king_roger je napisao/la:
Čekaj, Nadal se "pojavio" 2005, jel? Tada je uzeo prvi RG. Federer je od tada do danas osvojio 11 GS-a, mislim da je ipak to većina od ukupnih 15.
Vidi cijeli citat
Tada je imao 19 godina, ali svejedno doboljno dobar da osvoji RG. Tek je od prošle godine postao vrhunski igrač za sve podloge.
sve prolazi sve se mijenja, idu dani idu godine, samo Zrinjski ostaje ponos moje Hercegovine
- Najnovije
- Najčitanije
Hrvatski muški tenis na povijesno niskim razinama, najbolji igrač na 143. mjestu ATP ljestvice
13 sati•ATP Tour
Donna Vekić dva koraka unazad na WTA ljestvici, napredovale Martić i Ružić
13 sati•WTA Tour
Elise Mertens glatkom pobjedom u finalu do titule na WTA turniru u Singapuru
1 dan•WTA Tour
Mate Pavić: 'Publika nas je pogurala prema pobjedi'
2 dana•Davis Cup/Fed Cup
Mektić i Pavić osigurali treći bod, Hrvatska eliminirala Slovačku
2 dana•Davis Cup/Fed Cup
Belgijsko-američko finale na WTA turniru u Singapuru, kraj za prvu nositeljicu
2 dana•WTA Tour
Petra Marčinko ispustila samo četiri gema na startu kvalifikacija u Mumbaiju
2 dana•WTA Tour
Pratili smo posljednji dan prijelaznog roka: Rossoneri vrlo aktivni u završnici
14 sati•Nogomet
PROMO: SuperLiga ipak kreće!
15 sati•Nogomet
Gorica raskinula ugovor s dvojicom igrača
3 sata•Nogomet
Ivanušec uskoro opet na Maksimiru, Dinamo zbog toga mora zahvaliti nedavnom protivniku
6 sati•Nogomet
Pytlick se obrušio na Hrvate: 'Nije im prošlo jer smo pametniji, tako mogu igrati samo u Zagrebu'
15 sati•Rukomet
Super7 by SuperSport: I dalje čekamo osvajača jackpota, nagrada je narasla na 23.250 eura!
11 sati•Nogomet
Lazio izlazak iz loše forme traži kod momčadi protiv koje nije izgubio gotovo 12 godina
10 sati•Nogomet
Trade koji je šokirao košarkaški svijet: Luka Dončić poslan u Lakerse!
1 dan•Košarka